Discomfort is Her Superpower. Here’s Why. — Anne Bonney

 

Airdate: July 2, 2025

Julie Rose: What if you quit your job to pursue your childhood dream?

Anne Bonney: 'Cause there's a risk, "Is this gonna work out? Is this the right move? I don't know." But as you start to have these uncomfortable experiences and survive them and figure them out, you start to trust yourself more.

Julie Rose: Hey, it's Julie. Welcome to Uncomfy, a show about sticking with moments that challenge us even when they're uncomfortable. And I know you're probably wondering, "Why would anybody choose to be uncomfortable?" But I know from personal experience, and you probably do too, that sometimes a little bit of discomfort has benefits if we can stay open and curious about it. And that is what we're here to explore, so let's get Uncomfy.

I'm joined by Anne Bonney. She's a keynote speaker, a conference emcee, and host of a podcast called, get this, "Dancing In the Discomfort Zone." So, this is a match made in heaven. Anne, welcome.

Anne Bonney: Thank you, Julie. It's so good to be here.

Julie Rose: You call yourself a "discomfort enthusiast," which, I don't know, like, that's definitely not me. I wanna get better at this, but I don't love discomfort. So, when did this start for you? Do you remember? Were you just brought up this way?

Anne Bonney: Well, I had a very uncomfortable upbringing. You know, interestingly, I kind of did in a very safe and wonderful way. Um, you know, we lived in Missouri when I was in second grade, and I got home one spring day and my parents said, "Hey, we're moving to Saudi Arabia," and I lived in Saudi Arabia and Egypt and Greece, so I spent from ages 8 to 14 running around countries that I didn't know the language and I didn't know anybody, you know, and, and it was just very different cultures and all this stuff. And so, while all of the discomfort was very positive and very, you know, like, exciting, it was still uncomfortable 'cause it's like, "Well, I don't, I don't know where," you know? Um, so while I didn't recognize it at the time, I think that all of that, you know, out of your element kind of stuff set me up for a pretty fun and successful life embracing uncomfortable things: starting my own business, running marathons, you know, do, being curious about, "What can I do?" And it has been so positive and empowering for me that I, that I really want people to get comfy being Uncomfy, so when y'all reached out to have me on the podcast, I was so excited. I'm like, "It's home!"

Julie Rose: I really wanna explore with you kind of what is your magical "stuff," DNA, that makes it so that you can not shut down like the rest of us when, or at least res, so easily resist that desire to shut down. But I'd love to, let's do it in the form of storytelling, because you have some really great ones. I mean, you have great stories about this, and I'd love to start with, um, how you quit your job in education, you were a teacher, to go be a seal trainer, is that right? And then also, like, a falcon trainer?

Anne Bonney: Yeah. So, yeah, I went to, uh, college for special education and, and taught for a few years, uh, and then went to SeaWorld and saw the trainers of the killer whales and the sea lions and dolphins, and was like, "Oh my God. That's the job I always wanted as a little kid," and soon as we got back home to Boston, I started researching, like, "How can I get into this?" Andthe New England Aquarium was accepting volunteers and they had seals and sea lions in their colonies, so I started volunteering and cleaning fish and scrubbing floors. And after about eight months of that, a, a trainer job came open, and I had been so interested and so curious and so willing to work hard and pay my dues that they were like, "You want a job?" And I was like, "Yes," and I had made it no secret that I was interested in working there, but, um, it just worked out so beautifully, and, you know, but I mean,

Julie Rose: I mean, were you at, like, you were already into your career in teaching, you'd, you'd gone to college, I mean, that pivot is pretty dramatic. Was there a lot on the line for you?

Anne Bonney: Well, that's what my parents said, too. They're like, "You're gonna do what?" Um, yes. I mean, I was married at the time, so there was a bit of a safety net there, but I didn't really need it, you know, 'cause I had a job the whole time, um, and was just able to work in the volunteering that, you know, allowed me to, to pay my dues. And, yeah, I mean, one could say the sunk cost of, you know, full college education in education, um, and then two years of teaching was like, "You're gonna leave all that behind?" But the, and, and yes, that was super uncomfortable and it was like, "Is this the right decision?" Um, but ultimately, I mean, it was such a cool opportunity. It was such a great experience, um, and I was feeling a little disheartened with education anyway, so I'm not gonna say that I was perfectly happy where I was, um, but yeah, there was, there was discomfort of, "Is this gonna work, and is this, is this the right move? Is this, you know, what I wanna do?" But,

Julie Rose: like, what if, what if it turns out that, that you didn't? I mean, that was part of the risk, right? You're gonna burn your, well, kind of, like, walk away from this other career that's all about kind of, like, longevity and seniority and,

Anne Bonney: well, and one of the interesting things that I found out as I was researching, "Can I do this," was the degree that I had in psychology and special education was exactly what I needed to be a trainer. I didn't need the biology, I didn't need the, you know, any of that because we've got people at the aquarium to deal with that. I needed the training and the learning theory, which I had, so interestingly, my de, degree did, did help me.

Julie Rose: Oh, please don't tell me that training seals is the same as training children.

Anne Bonney: I'm not gonna tell you it's not. Hey, tell me your kids work for M&Ms, the seals work for fish. It's not that different.

Julie Rose: Oh, that is remarkable. So, okay, so that worked out for you, and was that then just the, like, "Well, that wasn't so bad. What else can I do that's uncomfortable?" Do these experiences kind of build on themselves in your, in your experience?

Anne Bonney: Yes, and it wasn't intentional at the time. You know, I didn't quite recognize and hadn't studied the value of discomfort and embracing it and seeking it out until, you know, five or six years ago. But it did build on itself because challenges and risks, 'cause that's why these things are uncomfortable, right, 'cause there's a risk. "Is this gonna work out? Is this the right move? I don't know." You know, and that's, that's the big question, um, but as you start to have these uncomfortable, conver, uh, uncomfortable experiences and survive them and figure them out, you start to trust yourself more, and you start to be able to talk to that voice of doubt in your head that's saying, "Whoa, whoa, this will not work. Whoa, whoa," you know? And sometimes it's not even the voice of doubt in your head. Sometimes, it's a voice of doubt from your mom or your spouse or your friends, you know? Um, and you start to be able to say, "Yeah, you know what? I, I think this is the right move. I'm gonna, I'm gonna give this a shot."That voice exists for a reason, though, for an important reason, evolutionarily to keep us safe.

Julie Rose: Um, so how have you learned to discern between when you, you know, the moments when you need to listen and the moments when you can say, "Ah, take a seat. We're gonna go for this."

Anne Bonney: Right. I, I think it starts with the recognition that that voice of doubt is there to keep you alive, which is super awesome, but it is a hundred percent risk averse. It is there to keep you alive, not to keep you happy, not to keep you growing and learning and thriving. It's just there to keep you out of danger of dying, right? And so, that first recognition helps you when you hear that voice of doubt to say, "Okay, cool." It's a speed bump. I wanna listen and say, "Okay, is this something I wanna listen to? Is there a bus coming? Yes. Move outta the way. Don't do that thing you are gonna do. But is this a career move that is a legit career move that could change your life for the better? Ah, okay." I'm making smart moves. I'm thinking about it. I'm listening to that voice of doubt, but I'm also saying, "Okay, I recognize what you are, and I'm also taking logic and all the things I've figured out and all my resources into account to, to, to see." And, and frankly, you never know for sure if it's the right move. That's the fun part of, of all of this is, is you never quite know, but the fact is you always, most of the time you do survive. It's just a little bit of a rocky road to get to the other side. You can figure it out even if it doesn't go how you want it.

Julie Rose: You've actually pushed yourself physically quite a bit in different aspects of your life. Marathoning, what? Is the goal to be, to do a marathon on every single continent?

Anne Bonney: Yeah, I finished that goal last fall, so I have, I can now say I have officially run a marathon on every continent.

Julie Rose: Can you tell us a story about having to push through some discomfort? I mean, I imagine every marathon is like that. Is there one that stands out?

Anne Bonney: Well, in fact, the most recent one, just last fall, I did my last two, Australia and Asia, I did it book ending on a three week vacation over in Australia and Asia, and my flight to Sydney to go do the Australia Marathon was delayed and I missed my connection and yada, yada, traveling all night, da da da. I didn't end up getting to Sydney until eight hours before the starting gun. I walked into my Airbnb at 10:00 PM and the race started at 6:00 AM the next morning. So, when my alarm went off at 4:30 in the morning, that voice of doubt was really loud. And I've done 30 marathons and, and, you know, four ultra marathons and two Ironmans, like, so I've done this stuff, and the voice of doubt in my head was going, "There's no way that you're gonna be able to go out and run 26 miles today." Like, it's, and, and the voice of doubt in your head knows everything, right? It, it starts listing off all the things, all the reasons. "Nutrition's been bad, hydration's been bad. You haven't moved, you've been on flights, you haven't slept, you," you know, like, and it made a lot of sense, and what I really wanted to do was stay in that bed and say, "Let's not take this risk. This is stupid. I can't do it." And finally what I did was I said to myself, "Anne, just start. Just start the race. Go out there and try. If the wheels fall off at mile 2, at mile 4, at mile 10, at mile 18, get in an Uber, come back, and go to bed. But just start and see what happens." And, um, I finished. I had a great day. I followed my race plan. I hit my time that I, I mean, literally it was a seven hour time limit for the race, I did, like, 6:15, which is a longer marathon than most of the ones I've done, but heck, I'm, 6:59 would've been a win for me at that point. I didn't care. I finished. So, I followed my race plan, I hydrated, I went into a lot of porta-potties, um, but I didn't balk it. I spent the next two days sleeping, but, uh, it worked!

Julie Rose: So, what do you take away from that, about when to, you know, what it takes to, to stay uncomfortable successfully?

Anne Bonney: Well, I mean, it's, it's assessing the situation and again saying, "Okay, this voice of doubt, should I listen to this right now?" You know, because if my health had seriously been in danger, I, I, I would not have gone out and done it. You know, there might have been some logic there, but once I thought about it, I was like, "Look, everything, you can always shift and pivot." That's why I call it "dancing" in the discomfort zone. It's not like a walk through the discomfort zone. You do a little sidestep here and a sidestep there and, you know, things aren't going the way you thought, so you go with a different plan. That was the moment that I said, "This first step of, 'Go start this race,' wasn't a, 'You have to finish this race,' it's just 'Go see what could happen, uh, and remain curious rather than stuck in one outcome,'" and that allowed me to go give it a shot. Let's see what happens. And thankfully, and I don't know how, I still don't know how it happened, but it worked. And now I've officially finished my Australian and my Asian marathon three weeks later.

Julie Rose: That's amazing, and it really does speak to the, to the power of curiosity, right? Just, just set aside the certainty of like, "For sure I'm not gonna survive, or for sure this is gonna be terrible, I'm gonna feel awful," and just say, "Well, what, what could happen? You know, what, what might happen? I, I wonder if I could actually pull this off." Um, does this extend to interpersonal relations?

Anne Bonney: I think it does with, I think all discomfort kind of, your brain treats it the same: danger, right? Um, and so whether it's a, it's an interpersonal situation like your marriage and you need to shift something or an interpersonal relationship at work, the more we get comfortable being uncomfortable, the more we trust ourselves to be able to figure it out. I don't think it matters what the discomfort is.

Julie Rose: Yeah. Can you tell us a story? Has that played out for you in a interpersonal way?

Anne Bonney: Yeah, you know, and this was before all the marathon business. After I worked at the New England Aquarium, I moved to Arizona and worked at the Arizona Sonora Desert Museum. And at both places, I needed to manage a bunch of volunteers, and most of the volunteers were retired, professional, successful people who were used to being the boss. And there was one volunteer that I did not get along with. And, and, you know, you understand that sometimes you just don't have to get along with people, but there wasn't a respect, a mutual respect there. Uh, she didn't respect me, I didn't respect her, and, and there was, you know, it just, it wasn't good. And I was really uncomfortable and I wanted, I talked to my boss at one point, like, "Hey, can we just get rid of her? Can we just fire this person, 'cause this isn't just working 'cause she's," and, and I was taking a very victim approach to it, looking back on it, going, "Oh, she doesn't respect me, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah." And Sue, my boss, was like, "Why don't you just go take her out to coffee and just try to find some common ground, see what you could do 'cause she's a very valuable volunteer, so we, we kind of need to fi figure this out." And so, we ended up going to lunch and I was like, "Eh," the whole time to myself, uh, and it ended up that once we got away from the roles and we actually talked to each other and learned about each other and I learned about her, um, we found some common ground in some, just, you know, and, and I don't think we would ever, like, invite each other to, to the 4th of July party, um, but we were able to work together. Uh, and it was an uncomfortable conversation, but it was well worth it because she ended up being a very valuable member of the team.

Julie Rose: So was that lunch, uh, "Hey, we're not getting along. Let's hash it out," or was it just about, "Hey, let's get to know each other." Like, what worked about that lunch do you think?

Anne Bonney: Uh, I think because I spoke my intentions upfront, you know? I said, "Annie, we need," interestingly, we have the same name, um, "You know, we need to work together, and I think we need to get to know each other a little as, as people so that we can work together," 'cause we both knew that we were not getting along. And so, I think entering into that, I, sort of the extension of the olive branch, saying, "Here's what I'd like to do. Here are my intentions. What do you think? Let's go do this." Um, and fortunately, she was, she was all in. She goes, "Yeah, I think that would be a valuable thing for us to do," um, so fortunately, she, she was ready to jump on the dance floor with me and, uh, and, and it worked out really, and that helped, you know, the willingness to have that tough conversation and, and there wasn't anything really to hash out. We just kind of were like oil and water, um, but once we found that commonality, we were able to find a mutual respect. Um, and I think a lot of, I was a young whipper snapper, so, you know, I think I thought I knew everything, um, and I needed to kind of be like, "Okay, who are you as a person? Let me find that." Um, but again, that was just uncomfortable 'cause I had to put my ego aside, saying, "I'm the boss here. I'm the trainer. I'm the one who gets paid to be here," you know, and I need to kinda set that aside, which, oftentimes, that ego calming part of emotional intelligence can be a real challenge. So, um, it was a great exercise for me, and it, it worked really well.

Julie Rose: Yeah. I appreciate you sharing that, Anne. Thank you.

Anne Bonney: Thanks.

Julie Rose: You get up on stages all around the world now and get on your podcast and encourage people to get uncomfortable. What's your pitch when people say, "Yeah, I'm, I'm fine.

Anne Bonney: I'm good.

Julie Rose: I'm fine in my corner.

Anne Bonney: Yeah.

Julie Rose: Please don't make me dance."

Anne Bonney: Well, and, and one of the big things that I, I let people know is like, "Just think about what you're saying 'no' to by saying 'yes' to comfort."By saying "no" to the discomfort of that tough conversation, you're saying "yes" to discomfort anyway, right? The discomfort we know is a lot more comfortable than the discomfort we don't know, and that's why we stay in these uncomfortable positions, bad marriages, bad jobs, bad interpersonal relationships without fixing them, you know, bad health because we're not, you know, taking, doing the workouts that are uncomfortable.We're still being uncomfortable, it's just the discomfort we know. And so, one of the things I encourage people to do is get curious, look at what is possible and what if this goes well, because often if you walk down that road you're like, "Ooh."

Julie Rose: Is there a daily practice that you like to do to try to, I mean, I think about it as a muscle, the way you talk about it, this, this curiosity, this willing to kind of stay a little uncomfortable. What can you on, what can people do on a daily basis?

Anne Bonney: Yeah. Interestingly, there's actually a brain, uh, the anterior midcingulate cortex. It is a piece of your brain that gets stronger in the stick-withitness and in the ability to be uncomfortable as you work it out. Um, so that, I mean, little daily things you could do, like, take a different route to work or, you know, shower in the dark or brush your teeth with your left ha, with your non-dominant hand, you know what I mean? Like, these stupid little discomforts, go to a, order something in a restaurant that you wouldn't normally order. These stupid little discomforts just give a little workout to your anterior midcingulate cortex, which makes you more able to stick with the uncomfortable stuff.

Julie Rose: Anne Bonney is a certified speaking professional. She's a keynote speaker and an emcee. She also has a podcast called "Dancing in the Discomfort Zone." You can find her stuff, her work, et cetera, at yourchangespeaker.com. Anne, thanks so much for sharing your stories today.

Anne Bonney: Thanks, Julie. It's been a blast, and I feel at home here on Uncomfy, so thanks for welcoming me in.

Julie Rose: And thank you for getting Uncomfy with us today. I would love to hear a recent experience you've had embracing a little bit of discomfort. Maybe it was a big career change, or maybe just a tough conversation, or are you one of those people that tries to stretch yourself physically to see what's possible? I'd love to hear your story. Email me at uncomfy@byu.edu or connect with us on social media. Uncomfy is a BYUradio podcast. Samuel Benson produces it, and the team includes Hyobin Kim and Sam Payne. Our theme music was composed by Kelsey Nay. I'm Julie Rose. Can't wait to get Uncomfy with you again next week.